Jib
Merchant 111.I will convince you,You stubborn sod.

JIB,

If I went through your posts and listed the insults I would be here all day. I don't consider my remarks as insults, just facts about one person.

Investor,

While I agree at first glance it did look as if Muqbil should have beaten Mister Monet. When you look at Mister Monet's next race in france, doesn't it raise a question that he may have been better than anticipated? 4 length win in a Group 2, and a rise to an OR of 116 from 106.

Be Lucky

Mtoto
You asked "why am i spending so much tme woring about what jib thinks".Well to be quite honest with you i'm not,We both know that he is the most ardent critic of these methods,And i WILL prove him wrong that is my aim.I no longer belong to any other threads associated with vdw and enjoy the subject.I don't bare anybody any malice for what has happened in the past.But when jib slags of the consistency of a horse and i feel i can explain the reasons why a horse went down call it after timing or whatever then iwill put my point of view accross.And it won't be feeding his ego eventually it will deflate it.

Mtoto
i understand what your saying but in the eyes of vdw that run Imo would have been seen : as a downturn,Remember we are looking at muqbil's next race not Mister Monet's.Remember the comments he made r.e Smart Tar Which should have seen of pegwell Bay in the previous race.A similar scenario really.That's how i see it but as we know interpretations differ.

think nichols is targeting the 3.40 - have backed all 4

wat do you know ! - a form horse wins !

For that effort all you seem to do is give me senseless unprovoked abuse. If I am wrong why dont you prove it, and do what I do? I can assure you that if you are successful I am gentleman enough not to say you have just been lucky.

JIB,

I suggest you go back and read some of your previous posts if you think my reply is unprovoked.

I think you will find it was Mr Pipe that thinks you were lucky. HE didn't expect the horse to win, he said so. I except it maybe possible you know more about his horses than he does, but I doubt it.

As far as I can see your sole purpose of posting on this thread is to take the piss. I don't really care what you think. When you are trying to convince folk that the form book is nonsense, consistent horse don't/can't win races, you are doing this thread and forum a disservice.

I also except I don't put up as many horses as you. Those I do put up ALL have the same things going for them. They are all running in good class races, they are all consistent. They have all done enough to show me they can confirm the trainers expectations. If folk could be bothered to read my other postings anyone could understand the reason for the selections. If they were interested I would be happy to explain most of what they don't understand in general terms. So I think I do make a constructive contribution to this thread.

but there again - my beloved "massey" wins the 4.05 - in spite of the form figs !

Mtoto,

I think you will find that Mr Pipe has been dragging a bush behind his tracks for many years now. You should use your formbooks to note how many 16/1+ winners the champion keeps having each season, look at it positively you could use it as an argument in favour of your consistency theories.

And yes I would like you go back and find my personal insults to you. Since your return to this thread I think you will have to scrub around to find any.

I back up my ideas by trying out methods to prove them, so far these methods have been successful. I criticise your ideas on a logical basis but you seem unable to answer without having the benefit of picking and choosing aftertime.

You seem jealous of my correspondence with Investor. All we do is argue harmlessly about the value of form figs, are you worried that foolishness is contagious?

T.C
" You said what do ya know a form horse won"

Just because a horse has consistency figures of 113 which Hout Bay had,It doesn't neccesarily mean it's a form horse.The 113 is a rating,Guide call it what you may,But form is totally different.

OK - Top consistancy figure then - thats what I am playing with at the moment - with some wildly "inconsistent" results !

No doubt - you - johnd - mtoto- barney - lee - et al will give your own definitions of "form" in due course - I hope they are "consistent"

T.c
LOL,What do you think iv'e been trying to do over the last 20 odd pages,Goodness me.If you cannot see what iv'e been trying to impart then i may aswell stop right now.When i first came on this thread well over 2 years ago,I spouted a lot of nonsense about vdw.I thought i knew it all,But i was eager to try and understand so i brought the pamphlets.Most of the thread at that point involved discusions on races and yes aftertimed results as you call them,But because of my eagerness i analysed the selections that were being given and could see patterns,Then i went one step further and brought the form books (best thing i ever did)This is why i offered to Give jib the books because i will not tell all.He could have researched them and told you his findings,But unfortunately he's declined (i did my best).If you seriously think that Lee,Barney,Mtoto are going to tell all you are very much mistaken my friend.I belonged to a forum that was solely vdw and even on there nothing was given on a plate,And i'm affraid it will be no different on here.

I am well aware that - the "Old Crowd" - are unlikly to offer any usefull advice - What I can't understand - is why they persist in disrupting the thread - with their "Holier than Thow" comments - when they are prepared to contribute "Nothing" -

If they don't like the way that the Tread is going - then why dont they simply go elsewhere and leave the thread to the members to develop - in any way that suits them - As it was doing very nicely - before they chose to return !!

There are still too many "Ouzelum" birds around - Maybe it is time we declared "OPen Season" on them !!

It never ceases to amaze how the sensitive souls who "left this thread because of the abuse" were often amongst the worst offenders then, and still are; only visiting this thread to malign or boast.
Sad existence, really!

ps Investor. That wouldn't include you, you are, at least, here for a more genuine purpose.

T.C
I don't think it ever was meant to be an "holier than thou attitude"At that particular time that's just the way it was,And there are some massive pointers on this thread on how to sort a race out by various posters.What i can't understand is Why selections are needed I sometimes wish that vdw would have pre raced A dozen or so of his selections then people would think differently,But unfortunately he didn't.I have personally enjoyed trying to fathom it out for myself and can't understand why others don't give it a bash,Finally if you class me as one of the "Old crowd" then just say the word and i won't post again,Simple as that.

johnd - still got the "Wet Towel" round my head - crunching the figures for the second "sample"

No - investor - I enjoy your posts !

My aproach has always tended towards the - Contrarian - but I believe that - The other point of view is always worth listening to ( and maybe worth learning from) - but when as from most of the "OLd Crowd" - it is sheer "Blind Dogma" - I loose patience !!

keep posting ! -

Investor My freind ,Mate

Quote "If you think Lee,Barney,Mtoto are going to tell all you are very much mistaken my friend" unquote


Then why are you, they here

If you know it all

Or think you know it all

If VDW works

Prove it
Simple

Wouldnt take long to have everybody hangin of your every word would it

Anyone who thinks that it is a waste of time concentating on a "Trainer" - wants their "Brains" looking at -

I have followed Prescott all season - and now that Duffield has left the scene - Prescott can be read "Like a Book " -

VDW said as much - but - the "Old Clowns" ignore it !!

I regularly get "Egg on my Face" trying to understand Nichols - but - I think he is targeting the "Gold Cup" - Again !

I did think "Funfair Wayne" - but it has a lousy draw - so Continent and Fire up the band EW both - Pomfret Lad - wuld be a typical "Nichols" result !!